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TOPIC: Water Heater TPR piping

Re: Water Heater TPR piping 16 years 6 months ago #1232

I just added a new narrative in my Electrical Section, warning that any deficiencies need to be evaluated by a qualified, licensed electrician. Hopfully that covers me now.
I had no clue this guy would crawl up on the roof and screw with this. I cant think of how I would have felt if he would have been hurt or worse. Unbelievable!

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Denver’s Best Home Inspection
www.denversbesthomeinspector.com
Body:Performing Home Inspections in Denver,  Parker, Castle Rock and the Entire Denver and Surrounding Area. 303-888-4599
key:  denver home inspection
URL pth: denver's-best-home-inspection.html
Denver Infrared...

Re: Water Heater TPR piping 16 years 6 months ago #1233

Dave - I lived in South America for 2 years.  Some of the things they do there are amazing.  They live with it.  Unfortunately, some of the things they do are really dangerous and not smart, to say the least.  They would heave a copper wire to hook over cables between light poles to steal power.  That bare wire would come into a bedroom window, was hot all the time, and they would rig it into some transformer in the house to use it for appliances or a jury-rigged outlet.  They had these small heaters for the shower, wired into one of those handled u-shaped devices that would lower into a sleeve to close the circuit and heat the water (old school).  It was exposed, right beside the shower and if water splashed on it, well, it splashed.  Children (!) used light-bulb sockets hanging from the ceiling to insert cables, taped in place, which they would connect directly to other things - a radio, fan, even a television.  An oven and a fridge would both be inserted, by the ends of improperly-sized, bare wires, into a 220 outlet on the wall, and used at the same time.  I saw this stuff all the time.  It is a way of life.  Your friend on the roof is just doing what he knows.  It is what it is.  My "zapped electrician" acquaintance was probably doing the same thing the next day, in the rain.  It is what it is.
      When I see odd electrical, it prints out as a very BOLD item on my report (the report on my website is a real inspection, bold items and all).  Bold, my report says, indicates a condition that is dangerous, unprofessional, expensive and/or can affect habitability.  There is a disclaimer which prints that says all BOLD items need to be checked by a qualified technician.
      I just this evening got an email from a client for whom I did an inspection last week.  She was not present, her mother was there.  At the inspection I noticed some weirdly replaced aluminum siding with a 1" hole in it.  There was what appeared to be an outline on the patio from a hot tub, but not recent.  In the panel box there was an unused hole from a previous, removed  breaker, and a large cable was still connected to the lugs.  The cable was cut, rolled up inside the box, and terminated with electrical tape.  This is a house, short sale, quickly put on the market to prevent foreclosure.  The seller spoke Spanish to his agent, not knowing that I was understanding.  He said some things he should not have said, about the hot tub and other things that were behind walls and such, saying that I would never find them.  The agent "translated" what was being said for the buyer's mother, explaining how the seller wanted everything in the house to be perfect for her daughter, and to please let him know what he could do for her.  Yes, he was lying, very smoothly, smile on his face.  I could have puked.  I deserve an Oscar for hot revealing how I wanted to remove his face...  My client was being totally set up.  This agent is worth his weight in navel lint, and I have been in touch with the local board about him.
    There is a much longer story, but this is a nub for your interest.  Bottom line - my client, a veterinarian in Massachusetts, emailed me to thank me profusely for my report.  The County is coming down on this house.  My client and myself are both protected by the BOLD on the report.  Unfortunately, I see houses like this, sold by people like this, three or four times a week.  It is a huge problem.  "Electricians" and "plumbers" and "HVAC specialists" and, and, and are everywhere and you and I have to protect ourselves. 
    It is what it is.

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Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC
Based in Bristow, serving all of Northern Virginia
www.jaymarinspect.com
Northern Virginia Home Inspector
Festina Lente - Make Haste Slowly

Re: Water Heater TPR piping 16 years 6 months ago #1234

In 1970 I started out in the industry, (after a couple years with a very small volume builder in Iowa) as a framer here in Denver with a good sized family owned builder.
The company sold & closed about 3-5 homes a week. Ranches, tri-levels and two-stories with a max of about 2000 sq. ft.
Of the 5-8 crews consisting of 4-6 men per crew there was one only one guy, (who was on one of my crews), who was not the typical construction guy from the midwest or similar. He spoke English, was polite, considerate and loved America.
Now as you say,
It is was it is. 

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Denver’s Best Home Inspection
www.denversbesthomeinspector.com
Body:Performing Home Inspections in Denver,  Parker, Castle Rock and the Entire Denver and Surrounding Area. 303-888-4599
key:  denver home inspection
URL pth: denver's-best-home-inspection.html
Denver Infrared...

Re: Water Heater TPR piping 16 years 6 months ago #1239

Dave - Sorry, I've been gone from early to late with no energy left over for messaging and the like.  I understand and appreciate what you are saying.  The point of my verbose commentary was to applaud you for your foresight in changing the verbiage in your reporting.  To restate the obvious, I think there are substantial reasons for needing to do that!  You might even want to have a legal professional look at it.

Because of the changes to our society we, as home inspectors, are ever more exposed to liability for hidden things we might miss.  It threatens our businesses, livelihoods, and the lifestyles our families enjoy.  Our reporting software and agreements need wording to help reduce our various exposures.

It may not be the problem for you there that it is for me here, but I am seeing horrific stuff, unthinking and just plain scary work in houses I am inspecting for clients.  I am fed up, as I should be!  And the lack of professionalism in new construction generally perturbs me as an inspector.  So many do not treat others as they would wish to be treated themselves.  I fear that attitude is becoming more pervasive.  As they might say in rural Virginia, "Ahm afeered it ain't agonna git no better."

Bottom line - ANYTHING we can do to lessen or mitigate our exposure to hidden problems is only to our benefit as individuals and professionals.  Good job on the rewording!

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Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC
Based in Bristow, serving all of Northern Virginia
www.jaymarinspect.com
Northern Virginia Home Inspector
Festina Lente - Make Haste Slowly

Re: Water Heater TPR piping 16 years 6 months ago #1244

Hey Dave!  Yesterday, on one of my inspections, the water heater TPR had no where to drain...  With a tear in my eye, I told my buyer (investor, six houses) of a home inspector friend in Colorado who ran across the same thing a couple of days ago.  He was impressed - this does not happen often.

I told him that in your case there was no easy solution.  At this house, a 30 year old pre-fab ranch plopped onto a poured concrete foundation, the improperly wired and plumbed water heater was beside a foundation wall through which a hole could be drilled and the TPR drained to a sump pump at the bottom of an exterior stair well.  The solution was a little difficult, but possible.

We looked at the sump pump.  It was plugged into a three-pronged interior extension cord, sharing that extension cord with a freezer and space heater on the screened back porch above.  The grounding prong was cut off of all three devices, well, so they could be plugged in.  The extension cord comes out of the bottom of the door.  It is plugged into an outlet on the wall.  The outlet (no cover) is hanging on the wall attached to Romex which goes into a hole leading into the house.  This Romex comes into the only bathroom, half way up the wall, leads down onto the floor, around behind the toilet and up the wall beside the sink.  It goes under the bottom of the cover plate on the GFI on the wall and pig-tailed into it.  The GFI was tripped (can't imagine why).

This GFI is doing yeoman's work.  When it is tripped so is everything in the bathroom - light, fan AND electric wall heater (!!!).  AND half the kitchen outlets, including the fridge and disposal.  AND the dining room outlets and light.  AND half the living room outlets.  AND both front bedrooms, outlets and ceiling fans.  AND another Romex coming out of the top of the cover plate, similarly pig-tailed, leading to a hole in the ceiling, and servicing a similar outlet box (no cover) in the attic, into which is plugged another interior extension cord.  Into this extension cord is plugged a hanging light bulb AND an attic fan.

This GFI is the equivalent of the Kennedy magic bullet!  I turned it back on thinking I would explode, but didn't...

On the sales contract are five male names, apparently heads of the various households living there.  In the house I counted 13 children's cribs and beds.  This does not mean that there are only 13 children living in the house.  Everyone shares this one little bathroom and the Yeoman GFI...

There is no point telling you about the other electrical, plumbing, appliance or HVAC issues.  YIKES!!!

But I am happy to report that we figured out how to discharge that TPR valve!

Oh, the stuff in the freezer was all moldy.  And in the fridge...  And the sump pump did not work.

I am NOT making this up - it was my most fun inspection all day!

Ahm afeered it ain't agonna git no better...

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Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC
Based in Bristow, serving all of Northern Virginia
www.jaymarinspect.com
Northern Virginia Home Inspector
Festina Lente - Make Haste Slowly
Last Edit: by Jay Markanich.

Re: Water Heater TPR piping 16 years 6 months ago #1247

Wow. 13 cribs..... How many bedroom house was this (sharing one bathroom)?

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Dominic Maricic
Home Inspector Pro Home Inspection Software - CEO
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